0:09

Right.

Jonathan, this is has been a long time in the making.

I think we had this conversation out in your farm over a year ago.

As I want to do a podcast, your wish I could.

Yep, give or take.

So, this you’re my second.

Guest.

0:24

I wanted you to be my first guess, but whatever it didn’t work out.

But the reason why I wanted you You to be here in front of me, talking about what you do.

It’s because I think when it comes to health, one of the most important things is our food because we are literally, what we eat, can agree more, you know?

0:43

And it’s not just the food where it’s coming from, how it’s grown chemicals that are put into the ground chemicals that are put into the feed for the animals.

Yep.

And you know there’s a, there’s an agenda I believe at their against Farmers against wholesome food.

1:00

And I think a lot of people don’t know that and what they think is actually, it’s a climate and the narrative and we need to save the planet.

But actually the policies that they’re trying to Institute are actually going to destroy the environment and Destroy biodiversity and destroy our health.

So I’m going to pass it back over to you.

1:18

And why don’t you tell me about yourself and the listeners who you are and how you got to where you are?

It’s a massive subject and where do we start?

So I started I’ve had a conventional agricultural education at Solano Contra College.

1:35

Many decades ago I had a quite a varied career went off and trained in construction management worked in a war for six years.

And then in London with another four years after that, then rode horses professionally, I’m a qualified.

A question coach, I didn’t do that this morning, but my father was a farmer.

1:53

My ancestors were farmers, and I was want to go back to it.

An opportunity came out 10 years ago.

Now, 10 years.

September to buy a piece of land and shelf on Saint Charles and we bought it and the be honest, it started as a hobby, that was it.

We have always been breeding sport.

2:09

Horse is fairly unsuccessfully and I had, I was renting grazing in various places around ceratin amersham and so I bought six cows and she’s carves.

Its really, and it was just a hobby for me, quite frankly to start with.

2:28

I Had No Agenda.

I had no.

No great business plan.

I had it was just purely for my pleasure and there they read Devon cattle, which originated from from exmoor originally, there are native breed and I chose them for many reasons.

2:44

One is and I’ll be perfectly honest, red cows and green grass.

A very pretty picture.

I agree.

And they are also, very docile, very easy animals to handle.

I do most of on my own.

Anyway, I started reading these cattle and the kept the heifers for Chris, the herd size and then as the has got bigger.

3:02

So what’s a heifer?

So young female.

Okay before she had a cough.

And so, we’ve started breeding them.

Then some of them are Bullock’s and we found those up and we had hundreds and partially based system, the animal finished.

3:18

So, was this special thing about Pasha, I know, but the listeners go, you always hear about grass fed and grass-finished.

What’s the difference?

Well, I use the word, pasture-fed deliberately not grass-fed.

The reason is a glass fence been hijacked.

Bye.

Supermarkets are said I’m advertising is a grass-fed but if you there is no legal definition, as country of grass-fed, that’s part of the problem.

3:38

So as long as I’m Hannibal is fed more than 50% 50% of its diet in its lifetime us, it can be cool grass fed that’s as bad as vague as it is.

So basically all the animals say, in the United States, that finished in feed, Lots on high cereal maze grain diets.

3:57

They don’t have our six, they can be called grass-fed, so, Basically, if you’ve been eating McDonald’s for almost half your life.

Yes.

And then you eat a healthy diet?

Yes, you can say, I’ve got it.

I’ve had a healthy diet which we know is not the case.

So I on whilst surfing the internet found the past fed livestock Association and I joined them probably eight or nine years ago.

4:19

I was one of the first producers certified producers in this country and and we’ve been producing beef ever since.

I mean, my first clients from my riding clients who came from riding lessons and I sold them The beef box while they were here for a lesson.

Let’s go back a bit to pasture fed, right.

Better than just grass.

4:35

Pasture fed is better on many levels one for the animal.

If you imagine a salad bowl of mixed leaves rather than just our iceberg, lettuce iceberg lettuce.

Full of water.

I happen to like it, but but a mixed leaf salad is much better for you than a straight.

4:53

So it’s just a much more varied by erect for the care.

There’s a more natural diet as well.

It’s a far more natural diet.

In this country, plant breeders his me over the last well God 50 years probably and maybe longer have been breeding grass varieties that are bred for one thing and one thing alone and that is dry matter production the quality of that dry matter.

5:17

The nutrient density of a crime master was irrelevant it was never measured, it was just purely, we put plant this seed we water it we put fertilizer on it and it grows big amount of grass Leaf cattle to eat at the Length, because it’s high in protein high energy, the grass cattle, grow quite fast in it.

5:35

What we have realized that in the last month we lost for a long time but it’s become more apparent.

The last 10 years and is that they’re growing, empty calories are going a lot of beef that is of little low fee value low in vitamins wrong fats.

5:51

A lot of lean tissue doesn’t taste very great deal and probably isn’t that good for you and that’s a reflection of what they’re eating.

So whether eating a Shit based diet were partially, based means a species diverse starts.

You got not any grasses, but you got clovers, you get herbs, like, plantain chicory.

6:13

I’ve got, probably a five or six different smaller herbs, which are not there in great quantities, but enough that they normally herbs and we deep-rooted and mineral-rich, and, therefore, provide the balance for the animals diet.

What we’ve also realized is that the The rumen system within the cow operates, much better when it has a more balanced diet with minerals and vitamins.

6:38

So there’s a host of bacteria in the rumen which digest the fiber and without correct balance of minerals and vitamins doesn’t work as effectively.

It’s funny humans are very similar.

If you eat a very small diverse diet, then you get colonized by a few bacteria which is actually not healthy for you.

6:56

What you want is a very varied colony in there, but by you Yes, which is reflected by the more diverse food sources you have.

Yeah.

And it just makes sense that animals would be the exact same.

Yeah.

And you literally are what you eat.

So it’s house eating nothing.

But apples all day long.

That’s not very healthy.

7:12

But and what we’ve also found with cattle now is that then their ruminant biome is almost very, very similar to the biome in the soil.

Hmm.

So what, when cattle are you people the current trend for Blaming cattle for all the ills of the world and climate change.

7:34

And God knows what else they belch out for the methane without cattle.

We wouldn’t have grasslands and we wouldn’t have grass and it because in the end, what the cows do, when they graze the grass and is their constant inoculating, the soil with bacteria and fungi and all microorganisms that create the saw biology, which cycle the nutrients, which hold the water within the soil Matrix, which create organic matter.

8:01

There’s so much, we don’t know.

So science, if you can call it that is is in its infancy.

When I was a boy, when I was at College, always studied was basic the mineral Mater, Matrix makeup of the soil.

So you had a class all assaults, Euler, sandy soil and if you had Sandy saw, you did this to it in the place.

8:18

We did that to me.

And it was had these characteristics in terms of conservation’s and etc.

Etc is so much more complicated than that.

I am sure I have read or heard somewhere that all life on this planet.

Planet exists because a foot deep, a soil layer.

8:33

That’s it.

Just it just a foot deep of soil that soil and their plant matter, that comes from it.

Everything living on this planet, if I miss from that.

Yeah, but by understanding also is its industrial agriculture.

You know, we’ve seen Revolution that we’ve seen, you have these Mass monocultures your pump, the start, you raped the soil of its nutrients that you pump it with fertilizer and insecticide and hair.

8:59

Beside.

That’s fundamentally a very flawed system because we’re basically starving, the soil.

Yes, aren’t we?

We’re doing, were starving it.

We’re killing it.

You know, nitrate is a poison simple as that you put enough, my trailer.

Some it kills everything.

So, yes or I mean, it all started after World War Two as I understand it at mean, we’re Nitro was explosive.

9:21

And they discovered that on these facts usually using nitrate to explosives.

Well, they spilt on the grass, a grass grew.

Fantastically in theory, dark green, Lush or estimate.

And yes, it’s bit.

Like I suppose giving our kids sugars and sweets and things like that around like crazy running around with just a bit and they’re very big, is it healthy for them?

9:45

No, it’s not.

You know, so we put an Archer on grass.

It was a outlet for this nitrate World War Two and that’s on top of during World War Two.

There was food rationing, there was food shortages my It’s both lived through the war and they both experienced that and every government since I said we will never be short of food again.

10:05

And so all agriculture policy both within this country within Europe has been based on mass production food, share it respective is quality.

Just mass production of, what do you think’s driving?

It just incompetence money.

Yeah, no, I mean, the food, the whole food production cycle has been hijacked by big Industries, want to call it that.

10:26

And whether you’re looking at, The chemical companies like Bayer or food processors.

They are when you look at these food processor, you think there are small company.

They’re not there in my building a company and the its massive.

And I mean the with other problem we have now in this country which is a site sideline is with abattoirs, there’s less and less abattoirs to go to now that they’re bigger and bigger, they’re owned by big companies who are not interested in processing cattle from small businesses like me.

10:54

So for instance, I mean, I go to abattoir in fireman farmer.

Sorry.

That’s about an hour away from me.

Down, the M3.

The other nearest one is Bedford beyond that be Chelmsford?

Wow, so what I do, we think we’re doing a good thing and this is great, but all the avatars through greater legislation, which is Lobby for by the big processes because they can afford to to have higher and higher Health, standards within the factory unit, separate wires, and a small avatars, which is really quite old hundred years old.

11:28

Can’t afford to refurbish and we build there’s just more and more centralization of food production and food processing.

Yeah, looks like centralization is happening across the world.

Every respect, everyone.

Just yeah, a plumbing disaster.

I mean, if for instance, cannot we use a red death and breed.

11:45

I’m very good friend of the farmer and Devon who they have a tart with waitrose, so all beef in.

Waitrose supermarkets, in Devon, is signed by Red Devon bull.

So, here’s a farm with lots of bars on it.

He houses up the cash.

It’ll in batches of 30 a week.

I think it is and then they get picked up by Lori and get driven to Manchester to be killed and processed to be driven back to be sold in the supermarket.

12:09

Devon, it’s crazy.

Absolutely Bonkers, who you know, absolute couple, that’s where waitrose I’ll come of him processes for them, but that’s where the all their processing and then it gets driven out from there.

So can I ask something?

You said, your dad was a farmer and yep, your ancestors.

12:27

So was your dad?

And to cattle and beef or my father, he or she passed away a couple years ago, but he was a great influence on me.

And he always said in his lifetime government, paid him to rip out every hedge filling, every Pond.

12:45

And then the second half is life, they pay them all back again.

That’s the craziness of our cultural policies that there.

And again, it’s such a big subject, it’s a reflection of our political system as well.

Some extent where every I’m you get a change of government.

You get a change of policy.

Yeah.

13:01

But food production and food security.

Should not be should be irrelevant of government.

It should be a political football, not at all, not at all.

It should go on.

It should be, you know, separated run independently where?

Look at the supply of food is consistent.

13:17

High quality, its kind of the environment, its demands High welfare, standards provides, good living for Farmers so they can for to reinvest and so on and so forth.

But I’ve come to the conclusion, government’s just Back things up.

We should we should just leave us alone but to get on with things.

13:32

But to be honest, that’s what farmers.

Do they just got on with what they are?

Quite of stoical.

Oh, trust me.

I know, I let this is a bit of a side step as of foot and ankle surgeon.

I always joke and I’m always worried.

When a farmer comes to see me because I’m thinking the foots barely hanging on because other patients will be complaining.

13:52

Oh, my God, this is terrible.

I’ve had this problem for ages.

I’ve tried everything and I go really.

So what’s the, you know, how Long, have you had this problem for?

And they were like four weeks.

I’m like, that’s it.

And what’s the problem?

I can’t.

I can’t run more than 20 kilometers.

I’m okay.

And then a farmer will come in and say yeah, I’ve had this pain for 30 years, my foots pointing 90 degrees, the wrong way and I can’t drive the tractor as fast as I usually won’t do or whatever.

14:17

Yeah, I got jumped out of it and that it’s sore but it’s okay.

It’s not that sort of like 9 out of 10 only 9 or 10, you know.

That’s so yes.

You’re very stoic breed.

Yeah, absolutely.

Right.

And I think That leg is carry on and doing the best they can the whole time.

14:32

But again, what?

And you also don’t throw anything away and what political policy doesn’t take account of it.

Is that when you’re planning a rotation environment, for saying our rotation, you’re looking at five minimum, five years up to 10 years ad, so you’re planning, what grows in that field and because we’ve had this monocultural system where we’ve had a common rat around here.

14:52

The common set of rotations been wheat or seen right Barney.

We also it by which not rotation to All because they’re three exhaustive crops.

You should, you know, you look at the how my father used to farm when he was his father Farms, which he was a child that they had not been choking about the Norfolk for course, rotation.

15:10

Well, they always had described that describe.

What is Norfolk?

Yeah.

It was a very, it was developed of Norfolk where all of that comes from a took place.

And basically, it said that, you know, one year you grow wheat one year, it be follow one year ago.

Turn.

It was a sheet with Grays.

And then what next?

Your back into it again.

So it’s so you always had a exhaustive crop.

15:28

Scrub to cash.

In on, you have the tournament with your different crop with different past differences.

Different route structure with the sheep and other cash crop grazed on so and they’re pooping on to it.

Yeah, adding organic matter, act correct, the original rotation system.

15:44

They had a fallow year as well, where it was, just left for a whole year to grow.

Grass, go follow and it was a rest yet.

Effectively, you we’ve moved on from there bit.

Because what we discovered now is actually, rather than resting it.

It, if you could graze with animals in a rotational system as a mimicking, what happens in the wild with say that the Battle of North America wildebeest of the African Savanna.

16:10

How and why Danimals Act is that a big herd their predicted on by lions or as or whatever?

So they keep Bunch together, they graze intensively in the area but there was migrating somewhere north or south of the Equator generally.

Excuse me, following the grazing.

16:27

And so they basically Here.

And I, and people in a small area, they trample that into the ground and they move on.

They won’t come back that area for a probably six months, minimum probably a year because we got one side and back down the other.

And so that has a chance to recover and rest and grow again.

16:43

And that the tool of the grass and the herbs grow above the ground, the deeper, the roots, go underground.

So, what you see above ground effects were somewhat underground?

You made a comment earlier about, you know, top 12 inches of topsoil.

It’s what we live on, what civilization?

Depends allies upon completely.

17:00

If we had 12 inches of active Topsail, will be okay, but we haven’t.

That’s the problem.

Basically, we’re cultivating now for the top four inches of soil and because we’re constantly turning this all over the whole time in modern modern conservation Zone, we in the game, the last 5-10 years we’ve adopted much more sort of diet drilling, which is where you cut a slot in the ground and put the seed in without actually inverting the soil.

17:27

Every time you invert saw Elise Common Sense fear.

But you also break up all the fungal structures within the soil microbial structures within the micro structure is essential to micro mycorrhizal structures, rise and Michael Riedel structures.

17:42

The fancy word, hell, yeah.

So mycorrhizal fungi is a fungus that lives in the soil, you can’t see and that we come in the microscope, but not to not to the human eye, and basically forms a symbiotic relationship, with plant roots.

So imagine that a plant, even like a Lucerne plant, which we’ll go down and meet with the soil and meter and a half each way, which is quite a big area, then forms, microwaves relationships.

18:06

So symbol rescue the mycorrhizal fungi and those that funghi exist throughout the whole soil.

So they can be drawing.

Moisture from technically half a mile away or more.

And then also the, the macros will finally make available phosphate for instance, but minerals within the soil, which otherwise wouldn’t be available to plants.

18:27

So and in Turn the plant feeds, the micro easel hungry with start spaces, sugar substance.

So, at nighttime, when it starts with photos of photosynthesizing sugars, go to a back down to root X State into the soil, feed them microbes and fungi, so they can grow.

18:48

And so on so forth.

Maybe every time you turn this all over plow it cultivate it.

You bust all that up.

You break up the whole system and so the that’s why the plant then can only Draw the nutrients from the area, where the roots are hence.

We then put fertilizer on top.

So to make up for the shortfall because there’s not enough nutrients to feed that plant in that small area and so cash is something.

19:12

Yeah, the argument amongst a lot of people these days has that There’s just not enough.

To go around.

There’s too many people and the air of can’t sustain 8 billion people, whatever it is and there’s not enough food for us.

19:31

I don’t personally believe in this.

I think that’s nonsense.

Yeah.

And I think it’s about how we use the resources that we’ve got.

I think it’s about having some people being less greedy and I’m talking about the top top.

Yeah, point one percent?

Yeah.

I mean, people say that regenerative farming and if you can talk about what that is, is not sustainable on a mass scale and we can’t The millions and London and whatever.

19:54

And it’s great out here in rural buckinghamshire.

Yeah, and what would you say to that?

I was well start with return to return to farming.

Basically means you’re eating think the soil, the soil is what civilization relies upon but it’ll in terms of on a bigger level rejected, farming’s about Animal Welfare about sociological welfare.

20:21

So the farmers themselves, it’s about basically rejoining the whole way we do things, making the whole system, healthier fitter, more resilient to climate change.

For instance, we know that soils with high carbon content, High, organic matter, contents are far, more tolerant drought and the solved with a low organic matter content.

20:47

So basically what I went to really And it, why didn’t you say, right?

I’m going to sell this amazing product, pasture, fed beef, which from the sounds of it, there’s not many people like you in this country doing this.

I mean, it is percentage of people raising cattle in this country.

21:05

What percentage, you know, of cows bread or bread like yours.

I mean, we’re talking about 50% 20%, what are we talking about?

A small percentage?

I don’t know exactly.

I don’t know, exactly, probably less than 5% are partially right now.

I’ve got a class.

I’ll Escape.

21:21

Wait, what?

We certify with positive end result.

My animals never get cereals.

Never get fed by products 100%, partial diet the whole time.

There are a lot of animals for instance, lamb sheep, which by the nature where they’re farmed are more or less, 100% positive that anyway, because in terms of marketing and Commercial angle, if you have to start feeding creep feed, which is undergoing serial based protein, diet, two Lambs to Fan them is so expensive.

21:50

It’s not profitable to Farmland that waste ammo majority of Learners country is produced off grass.

So all the lamb in Wales is good stuff.

Pretty much yeah.

Okay.

What I sell local we set out right from the start, my wife myself just to sell locally because it’s all this traveling, which is burning fossil fuels, which is great enough, a problem, you know, food should be grown to include eating locally and eating seasonally and that is key.

22:16

Amen to that, but I mean, because I would have thought with your premium That you would have said, right?

I’m going to sell to the fancy restaurants in London and Michelin markup, but you’ve actually got a Butchery on your farm.

You don’t have a farm shop, it’s actually you buy directly from you.

Is that right?

22:31

Great.

Yeah.

And we’ve, we’ve stayed away from harm shop, several reasons one, because if you have a farm shop used to staff it, six days a week and also where we are located on a very busy Main Road.

Highways wouldn’t be very happy about having a farm shop.

Thanks a lot of ins and outs the whole times.

22:48

That’s the entrance.

The traffic hazards.

And we Supply a farm shop quickly manner, great missions in which is a really good Farm Shop.

We don’t need we don’t need to be a farm shop, okay?

I need to check that farm shut because the reality is most Farm shops.

23:05

Have disappointed, me is basically what you would get in a supermarket.

It’s all rapeseed oil.

Yellow nonsense.

Processed, important France.

Yeah.

And I’m like, where’s my local projects?

You know, I want to get local food like briefly manner.

We can recommend, we’ve worked with them.

For a long time now, seven, eight years now probably and their family run business.

23:26

It was a nursery, really, they opened the farm shop.

What a nursery.

I think then the farm shop came and they make a point of, basically only selling meat.

So, their paltry comes from sring their lamb and pork comes from chops and Giles there’s just an adjacent Village nearby.

23:46

Yeah.

The beef comes from childhood to ours ours.

Eggs are also local.

I’m not quite sure where they are, but they’re pretty local medicines all local, but virtually all their fresh produce the vegetables.

I’m not certain about their salad products, but I, I know the family that run it and their intent is to buy local.

24:06

So I’m really far this.

I am for, you know, supporting local farmers.

I mean, I have you seen what’s been going on with the Dutch Farmers?

Yes, we talk about that in a second but I think there’s a, there’s an attack on Farmers on.

People growing food.

There’s an agenda by certain people like Bill Gates, buying all the Farmland in America.

24:26

We should talk about that as well.

And I think it’s about communities, we need communities.

Many people getting food from their local farmer and knowing their local farmer, buying directly from them and getting the middleman, the middle Pitts who takes most of the profit out of the equations.

What do you think of that?

24:41

Totally, that’s exactly what we do.

That’s the model we are based on, you know it’s all about traceability of food and food.

Security.

But we have a, to be fair, this country.

Every animal is tagged individually.

24:59

So we know, like, when a calf is born, it has a tab.

You’ll see them in their little bright yellow tags.

And there is a number on that number is unique, that animal.

It’s all of us live has to be tagged by law with two tanks.

When it eventually goes to the abattoir be killed and processed that same tag.

25:16

Number is put onto the carcass to where it goes.

The Processor with any time it loses identities when it’s cut into lamb chops or steaks or whatever.

So it’s a pretty good system.

However, if you go and this is advantage of what we have, we have the victory on the farm.

25:33

People come to the farm, to collect, they see the animals that you don’t need to be an expert in Animal Welfare, to look at the animals and know, they’re healthy know their content because they’re calm and quiet and they’ve got eat oats and bright eyes, and all the nothing for that.

Yeah, the kids love walking around your farm, in looking all that it was And you know, we always say that, you know, what do we say enough in a Butchery is all on the farm.

25:56

So we know where it came from.

We know how it’s been treated.

We know the appetite is gone to the road miles.

The only red Mars are animals have is from the farm to the abattoir and back again, which is probably about 50 miles there 15 or so.

Can I say something?

Controversial matters is that there’s a whole there’s been a bill passed recently about some mRNA technology vaccines and The livestock.

26:20

Yeah, what’s your view on that?

Are you going to be injecting this stuff?

Into your life?

We have, I’m holding my breath here with because you know, my answer I’m a pragmatist.

I from a ethical and a commercial point of view, avoid vaccines where I can.

26:39

However, for instance, we sheep, we do vaccinate the use with a broad spectrum vaccine, which protects them.

It’s one of the ironies of she They evolved in credit tough climate of environments but they have a willingness to die like no other animal I’ve ever known to pretty stupid animals, they sorry.

27:02

But they are what a cow gets ill.

It wants to live so you call the vet.

If it needs to have some antibiotics, has some antibiotics and it will do everything in its power to stay alive, sheep, you call the, that comes and treats it, and now, if it’s dead.

27:18

Anyway, so you get the point.

And we was that go with called a vet for because you know, they just don’t anyway.

So we do vaccinate the accept the the sheep and that’s that’s the only sort of thing we do about the Catalina vaccinators also will this law that’s being passed?

27:35

Does it mean that every animal has to be vaccinated or not?

That’s not my understanding is.

No it doesn’t.

I think it’s still a choice thing.

But I understand the logic of why they would want to do that.

No.

I don’t know.

27:50

So much in lots of things this country, we do things like why didn’t that was?

No, there’s no reason for it.

It’s but other than there’s some Pharma company behind it.

They make their money by selling vaccines, I don’t know.

It’s a lot of health and safety that they bring in, you know, what even diseases, they want to fax in it against like, what exactly are they hoping to vaccinate against?

28:09

I don’t know that, I’ll be honest.

I don’t know the full detail of it, but I mean, in cattle are effectively five main diseases, probably in this country.

Three foot and mouth.

We all know about to, but TV, we all know about.

Yeah, there’s something called bovine viral, diarrhea, BBD, ibr, Joanie’s and leptospirosis.

28:33

So six or six major kind of, I’m going to have to pause because my my daughters and the back and it’s nice too much go, sorry for that rude.

Interruption anybody who’s watching?

This will have seen my daughter in the background.

That’s why I had to stop and tell her to kindly stop monkeying around.

28:49

Anyway, you’re talking about the vaccines and vaccinating your hairdo.

Yeah, and which ones and you’re telling me you don’t vaccinate any of your beef cattle, these casual guy that only work in this country.

29:05

Now is very much geared to prevention rather than cure, but that’s great.

That’s what it should be, which wasn’t the case, probably 20 years ago, where everything got treated with, you know, you went to get something to treat it with something a drug.

Now, like, with my vets, we work on herd health, Fans flock health plans.

29:20

We look at ways of managing the animals and that’s for everything from feeding to housing, how their house ventilation sunlight, those kind of things, cleanliness of the water protocols, in terms of introducing new balls.

So all new balls are tested Health tested for range of rough, different diseases there, I stayed where they come in and they’re not introduced to the hurdle, we know unless we can do their hunting clean.

29:46

So it’s those kind of things if you, if you manage Animals in a correct way sickness is often a reflection of poor living standards.

And this is exactly I was going to say I would say the same is about human beings.

30:08

Is I don’t know which one is correct but they both do.

He’s germ theory.

Is that there’s nasty germs out there and they’re going to kill you and we need antibiotics and drugs to prevent or does it trained to be which is that actually we’re surrounded by bacteria in our gut.

For example there’s more bacteria than the whole cumulative number of cells in our human cells.

30:27

So you know, we live with these bacteria and it’s symbiotic relationship.

And they’re actually useful.

We need them for hormones and digesting our food.

And actually, if the host the terrain is / and not healthy, and that will create an imbalance in sickness.

And, and I’m, I’ll be honest with you, I’m kind of drifting more towards that.

30:46

Yes, dearie.

Unfortunately, we have a, we have an immune system.

Every living creature has an immune system.

Bloody incredible one.

Yes, let it do its job, but to do its job.

It has to recognize diseases.

If you protect it from diseases, the whole time in ever recognizes, This is my Layman’s Farmers theory on it between us but so that’s absolutely right.

31:07

I mean, you’d their immune system is trained and every exposure to bacteria, acknowledges and understands, and it knows how to deal with it next time.

Yes.

And if you look at what happened, when you know, the Spanish and the Portuguese went to America for the first time and the native people weren’t exposed to any of the smallpox, whether it was no wipe them out and you know, Because it would they hadn’t been trained their immune systems were didn’t know what they were relieved, they were naive.

31:36

Yeah.

So I totally agree with that.

Yeah, that’s the last of you.

We hope the finals if they have a really good level nutrition, which always do because they have this pasture based diet which stresses are the factor, which is a massive influence on on human and animal health.

Absolutely it we have been guilty in the past of housing animals to intensively and when they can’t exhibit their Norm behaviors.

31:59

So, you know, animals animals, don’t shit.

They lie, if I can help it, I do, why would you?

Yes, they will drink here.

They don’t go poo in the their water, if they can help it, but when they put so tight together, they can’t go and lie here on the dry, eat here, poo, their drink there, and they have to all in one place, you know.

32:20

That is it any wonder?

They become sick and Ill.

So we have a low although we have buildings to house animals.

So we car will the animals indoors.

That is mainly for what’s my way?

A fair and there’s because I can have a hundred thousand doors and check them every few hours switch, the light on, they’re fine walk away.

32:39

I mean we could have cameras we don’t but and it makes it makes it easy for me.

If they’re carving out and feeling they have a problem, I can’t help them because I’m on my own was.

If indoors I can get them into a pen and into a crash and I can help them but the rest of the time they’re outside on the fields and the pastures and so their house roughly four months a year.

32:58

So they come in sometime in December and then they house into a carving.

Arch.

And then within probably 34 weeks, three to four days.

Sorry of carving they go outside and that 34 days just allows us to observe them.

Make sure the coffee is drinking of colostrum because that is also absolutely to Animal Health of cars and Lambs don’t get a proper dose of colostrum the first 24 hours of birth.

33:19

They are weak and sickly for the rest of their lives.

Pretty much doesn’t matter what you do.

Some after that, that first inoculation are called little of colostrum is absolutely key, so the cows have to be in good health, they’re producing good quality.

The colostrum cars had to be, we not getting some Mass subject.

33:38

So we’ve read animals that are highly productive.

Highly muscle, you’ve had double muscling and cattle know.

It’s it’s a it’s a genetic defect that’s been Red Line bread into animals.

So for instance, like a Belgian Blue is a breeder cow which has double Mustang which bumps you look at bum.

33:58

It’s edible have normal cow shape.

Um, it’s literally like, Someone Botox to oh my God.

Yes that literally God the problem with that is when those so Belgian Blue cattle.

What most of my everyone’s going to be Googling Belgian Blue.

34:15

Yeah it’s now about trending and the majority of if you say use a Belgian Blue on another cow because the cops are so heavily muscled, they can’t have a normal birth as to put it there by C-section.

Oh wow.

So I mean, there was a farmer in rickmansworth.

34:31

With, who was one of the first importance of Belgium Belize, he had a Veterinary Clinic set up on the farm.

Every single calf was developed by C-section literally, and this is the drive to basically have a beef animal at the end of the day, which we call it a kill out.

34:48

So when you, if you’re wearing and we’ll say it’s ways away. 600 kilos when it kills out the bit, so take away the guts, the feet and rest of it, the bit that we can then process is the capsense it.

We should only 55% of the live weight.

So the heavier muscle that is we call it confirmation the better, the confirmation have it as the cutout is therefore they got more paid for them.

35:11

Got paid more for the animals, that’s so money.

But yeah it’s you look at you think why on I look at this cattle and their obscene, why on Earth would you have a cow?

Looks like that.

If we weren’t here, they would just die out because it all they’d all died at Birth.

They would never it wouldn’t carry on this is this is ours human beings that have done this you know because it in the wild we just met Things up that would not have happened.

35:34

That carpool not been born, so it couldn’t have been born.

It would have that genetic defect would have died there and then with its mother, probably in the sounds cruel.

But in, that’s what would have happened, but we developed the delivered by C-section.

Look at this, he’s a real commercial animal.

Yep.

More meat office, animal more efficient a scope and then we bred for it.

35:52

So, how are you doing this?

Because you’re, you know, a small farm.

Yeah.

Well, I think assume your smoke alarm.

Yep.

And the argument is, you need these big large massive Farms and industrialization to make money, and but have you had that challenge and how is it working for you the financial model?

36:11

I mean, what’s the incentive for another farmer potentially listening to this and thinking, hey, I’m going to stop doing what I’m doing and I’m going to follow Jonathan, Chapman’s route.

Um, not way of with fortunately, our we live in, there’s a reason the urban area.

36:26

So there’s a big market place here for us.

If you lived in the Peak District up on the hill somewhere, you could direct selling wouldn’t be an option for you.

But again, if you are, we should learn from history.

If you look back Hill, Farms used to produce what we call stores.

So young animals sheep and cattle, young cattle that there were moved to the lowland Farms who have got more feet throughout the year.

36:50

There’s a little softer climate and they would finish them and they would be a little so close to the urban markets where the marketplace is and that’s what used to happen the whole time but nowadays it’s You’ve got these some massive production units, which are trying to produce food cheaper and cheaper and cheaper the whole time because that’s what in theory every everyone demands.

37:14

But if you look at Food inflation compared to inflation other Goods, I think in 1963, this is from can’t our index.

I got this from electron, went to the average household’s spent thirty three percent of their income on food.

37:32

In early 2020s, it was less than 6%.

Wow, that’s massive.

Our parents never wasted food, my parents never threw food away.

It would be sacrilege, just would never happen.

That was a left over from the war when food was short.

37:50

And, you know, everything was utilized the last course of that the last course of action for food was not the waste bin but the dog, you know, it’s all a pig in the yard sh you know I also think his priority like People valued good foods like what you’re eating has mattered.

38:07

Whereas now it’s all about convenience.

Just everyone’s too busy and was rushing away, but some people say to me all the time, oh, it’s too expensive.

We don’t have the money or even their own health, but they’re quite happy to Splash out on a holiday abroad for thousands of pounds, right?

And their car rental for a big flash 4×4 tractor, Chelsea tractor when it comes to the actual things that are good for them.

38:30

They skimp on that.

I mean, not the thing.

Apprise me of iced coffee and I’m guilty of it, okay?

The cost of coffee event £3.50 on a latte or whatever.

It’s not here to buy your coffee locally from someone who roasts it and have it delivered.

38:47

That’s what we do.

I was I mean, you know, that’s the trouble with I have flat-out lifestyle and I need to slow down a bit.

I know that, you know what?

I’m going to show you after this this podcast, I’m going to show you my little coffee machine.

Yeah, I’ll tell you where to get your coffee beans from you and they will be delivered every week.

39:02

And as a different like from Ethiopia and Rwanda wherever and their absolute, it’s amazing.

But and that freshly brewed coffee is, oh, I just you just smell the coffee and it just brings is amazing.

And, and you become snow up.

I’ll be honest with you.

The idea of me, drinking, cost of coffee at Starbucks.

39:19

I will look down at that with contempt it’s not even coffee doing color coffees, just brand liquid, but you’re right.

You hit this.

It’s all about convenience and I don’t speed of our lifestyles and you know, like my wife works full time.

In London, she comes back.

39:36

Probably having a 7:30 at night and she will pretty religiously cook, a proper meal.

For all of us that takes some doing to do that.

She gets up our base 5, she leaves the opposite, my wife needs to hear this so that she gets up at 5:30.

Yes, she leaves three 6:30 or 7:00, catch the train to London.

39:54

She works in more gate to close back by train.

She gets back at 7:30 ish in the evening.

Depending the trains running, she cooks a meal for it.

It.

Yes, and a meal.

We’ve got our vegetables are organic.

They come from 310-mile menu, which is how Wickham they delivered every weeks.

40:10

A box of ice walls, all seasonal.

We never know what we’re getting, you know.

Luckily, put something in and their belief in which explains what some of them are because I didn’t know what it was.

So with but you’re just eating beef, aren’t you just having steak every night?

No, we got Beast out a little bit, but know, we have those.

40:27

We do lamb and pork and we do while Venus as well.

So we have a, we very well.

And on that note, I want some venison burgers again, ya Tink thing that and that’s just it, it’s fantastic, it’s mind-blowing, they take well, venison is as part of bed as it gets, I never is nothing more positive better than War medicine and actually round here.

40:48

Now there are becoming a bit of a plague because they’re not kept in check and pretty clear.

Oh dear, well I don’t know, actually I go running across the fields and I love cross-country running and I love it.

When I see the deer, the Beautiful Creatures are you?

No question at all but they are fairly devastating to Woodland.

41:06

Yeah they will ease how all the understory and you end up.

You’ve got will go through these Woods sometimes.

Think it’s nothing on the ground.

They just eat and everything and everything up to about sort of a true.

Yeah, so again everything in Balance, you know, there’s nothing that predicts on dear, this country apart from Cars we buy used to predict it here.

41:23

Oh going back wolves probably identical people table dude.

Yeah people are we are the ultimate predator and we found three must have hunted.

Yeah.

So that the funny thing about you just said about your wife go, I think that’s one of the key things as well.

We need to go back to cooking our own food from scratch to my wife.

41:41

Works three days a week.

She also gets up at 5:00 5:00 5:30 and leaves and comes back 7:30 but I’m a really good husband.

I have I’ve done already.

Yeah.

So I probably probably cook for at the seven meals a week and then she does either 3 and and quite often we do batch cooking.

41:58

Yeah so that it runs over and I know some people don’t like eating leftovers.

Anyway, I don’t have a problem with leftover lasagna.

Yeah, it’s great.

Something better Second Time Around.

Yeah.

Absolutely.

And the thing is, I think if you store your food and you know, what’s going into your food, and your ingredients are minimal, and there’s no junk and preservatives and colorings, and God knows what else that’s surely, must be better for.

42:24

You has to be, has to be, has to be, has to be, has to be.

But, and, and it’s some people say, well, I don’t have the time I’m quite Is he?

Yeah, you make the time, it’s about the priority.

What’s more important is it more important to sit in front of the TV for an hour and a half, or cook a meal for 45 minutes to an hour.

42:42

You hit the nail on the head because that’s exactly, we do it.

But for lots of it is one because we want to eat.

Well to, I want to sit down my two girls who I’ve been seven.

I want to hear about that day.

I want to talk to them.

This is what we’re say.

Societies broken down.

Its heart is broken and it’s because we don’t sit around a table and have Have dinner as a family anymore.

43:03

Why?

I can get a little bit more conspiratorial.

I think there’s a there’s an agenda to bring a big down the family unit.

Honestly I think I think they don’t like the family unit, but we have a choice.

We have a choice.

We have a choice to change that we can we can and I mean I my girls are endless in.

43:20

So yours are same endlessly entertaining and those very for those who don’t watch the video of this and my daughters were all around this Garden.

First banging waving and trying their best to distract us and my wife is doing a hopeless job at keeping them away by.

43:39

There you go, but we’re social creatures.

I’ll be that’s what we meant to do.

Socialize with each other, entertained, each other, tell stories, you know, and I connect connect with your neighbors love thy neighbor.

43:55

Yeah, but that is just not feel.

You’re almost distrustful mistrustful of your neighbor, you don’t know.

I think that they’re gonna hurt me.

They are, they dancers, don’t know them, you don’t know them, you know, them something a little known as fearful.

Once you do it, it’s not fearful because nobody is you knows absolutely.

44:10

And you know what, I think the vast majority of human beings are good people and we all want the same thing.

We want to be loved, we want to love back, we want to look after our family.

Have ahead and who roof over our heads Emile.

Yeah, I’m actually with herd animals, just like cattle and sheep Rock animals.

44:26

We want to be Together in if necessary, in a bit of a hierarchy because we’re not all leaders, we’re not all followers, but Society needs, all of those people to make up a structured society.

And and you feel secure.

44:41

When you like that, it’s like every in the Cowherd and I learned from watching nature but in a coward there’s always a matriarch.

I don’t know that.

Yeah, always, I’m really unsure when you move from field to field The Matriarch cow does not go first.

She will send the outliers first.

44:59

So in the social structure of the Cowherd, the top cows stay in the middle historically, because they’ve been protected from predators and things like that, and it’s across the river will be across the river.

It’s not the lead wildebeest.

Their first itself wants the Crocs have them others get through, but it’s incredibly structured.

45:19

So when they have calves, they will one cow will sit with the cards in the field or stand with account carbon, The Fairly be probably 20 car.

Calves and one or two cows the cows off goes off and Grays and goes to the water trough and drinks and comes back.

And I swap over, it’s like childminding wow and if you if you just take the time to watch them, it is unbelievable.

45:39

How it works and they all our content.

If that matriarch cow go is taken out for whatever reason guys.

The whole structure gets a bit mixed up again until it’s sorted out it’s a bit chaotic and then it’s sorted out again and there’s new matriarch and the Then goes on as it did before and it absolutely fascinating this.

46:00

And so to me, so social structure is a natural thing.

It is getting really get off my off my no, no, tell us this beautiful.

I agree.

I think.

We’re Community animals were social animals.

I think we’re, we’re, we need to restore that whole family unit, and part of what I’ve been trying to do, what I love about my job as since I’ve moved out of London.

46:26

London and work here as I really feel like I am part of the community.

I can’t go down the High Street with it without bumping into a patient.

Yeah.

And or even if I’m just walking down the road.

So I’ve had people pull over in their car and say, look at my foot is better.

46:41

I’m and and you feel part of the community and, you know, the school and and the people around you, a warm fuzzy feeling.

If you’re right, warm fuzzy feeling, and I love that.

And that’s why, you know, I get all my meat from you.

I love the fact you’re a logo.

Armor, just a couple of miles away.

46:57

And the meat is, well, looked after the animals are well, looked after it is proper welfare that the soils not being bombarded with chemicals and the Animals aren’t being injected and the animals, look healthy and happy and I’m, you know, trying to sort of my food from a local Cooperative now, and get my beat in my honey from local beekeeper.

47:20

You know, it’s all about local community building and I think that’s where that’s where we need to.

Go.

We need, there’s a big push towards centralization.

You’d even argue centralization of government One World Government, you know.

Just yeah.

Everybody, you know, the EU was why I was against the EU.

47:37

I think it’s hard enough, controlling our government in Westminster never mind, a government in Brussels, that’s totally unaccountable and and actually what we need to do is go the opposite direction, we knew.

So don’t decentralized everything, Education Health, yes, food sourcing.

47:56

Everything can return to farming feed the world.

Yes, it can.

I went to conference a few weeks ago about decarbonizing your farms and the speaker there said that the population is going to Plateau 11 you know whatever in 2040 or something that I don’t know, come up quite exactly when it was and that we should be worried about population control.

48:21

I would be skeptical about that.

I think will be a big step to say, don’t worry, the population will Plateau, and we’ll all be fine.

We’re just gear up for that population and providing food for that population.

I understand the political sociological problems with trying to control population.

48:43

I think in Western Europe, the population without immigration is probably decreasing slightly but we and in how do you influence the areas of the world where population is out of control?

Quite frankly with great difficulty, I don’t I accept it.

I don’t have the answers to that.

48:59

I do think that if we Farm regenerative lie and improve soil Health then the soil will get better at recycling.

You Nutrients within the soil and therefore the we can grow more productive crops on that soil.

49:20

The biggest restriction in or limiting factor in crop yield is always water 100% fertilize grass of the cows.

Come home, it doesn’t rain, we have Sunshine, it doesn’t go any grass.

So sunshine, you can say and water are the two key elements.

49:36

So if we can hold more water within the soil, So that throughout the year, there’s a higher water level on props for that.

You need organic matter.

Correct.

Our crops with more productive.

So if you do have organic matter, the topsoil just washes away, doesn’t it many things?

49:52

You know what with us or structure goes because it’s the it’s the organizer the holds of holds the particles together but also you by holding the word part of holding the soil particles together, you create spaces in which water is Held once, once all going back and drops and I’ll give it a like a sponge yes like a Spanish one shall give you example.

50:16

So as a farm in Surah which I farmed and what it’s a mid-tier scholarship scheme in that stewardship scheme, you have to take a soil sample of all the fields before you start five-year agreement.

And again, at the end to see how much improvement you’ve brought about in the arable fields, which have been farmed for arable for 30 years.

50:36

Almost non-stop, the organic matter was less than 2%.

On the same Farm is two bits of Portland in front of the house and behind the main house, which had been permit, grass, forever and ever or go by the content of six and a half percent.

That is massive.

50:52

So, you know, four and a half percent difference between two swords which is geologically the same terms of aspect and exposure and rainfall.

All these other things, exactly the same differences that soil.

Relies on a perennial plant, a pretty important one that grows all year round basically growing in the soil, fill in the soil biology.

51:11

So cycling nutrients, retaining the water within the soil arable soils as you plant a crop in and they say September and of September time.

It grows through the winter.

You harvest it in july/august time.

There’s three months.

Two months a year when nothing’s growing in it.

51:27

So all the soil soil biology shuts down goes dormant effectively and in those two or three month, period nothing’s happening.

So if you got grass, that doesn’t happen.

It’s 12 months a year.

It’s a grass, is sequestering carbon into the soil of iPhones, so it isn’t, is it possible to have a completely vegan lifestyle?

51:46

Say, the whole population just was Egan.

Yep.

And you have these fake burgers?

Mass crops what would happen to our environment and the population and the planet it crash will start.

So I feel the need to ask you again.

52:04

This is very important to all those vegan listeners out there.

If we, if we as a human species, it nothing but vegan.

Yep.

And would you do that?

We’ve got all this monoculture crops we stopped.

Stopped having a livestock because they’re only there to feed us.

52:20

So if they’re not, That’s that perception.

That’s not the case.

But yes.

Yes.

So if it’s just monoculture, what will that do to the soil, to our environment?

And to our planet, will it save the planet?

Like the think it will?

Because that’s what their argument is.

That we are killing the planet by having beef quite the opposite.

52:37

If you could say everyone at organic vegetables, different matter, organic vegetables are grown with animals within the rotation.

So cattle and sheep with in a rotation so though micro taters and feel $1.

Year the next year, it’ll be down to grasp overlay.

52:55

They’ll have that 3 years.

The animals will fertilize the soil then it going to wheat then back to potatoes.

Again, that kind of thing, soil health.

Relies completely on animal interaction.

So, so in our case, grasslands ruminants eating grass.

53:16

You know, and then fertilizing the soil without it.

So we’ll just hear it.

Go downhill.

Wow.

And what about what about the argument that cars are causing global warming white?

So it change it.

It’s methane cycle is a closed cycle so there are more or less the same number have to apologize.

53:36

My children making funny faces behind you with your main, very difficult to concentrate and my wife’s duty today was to make sure they didn’t do this, which is failing miserably at I’m very sorry.

Let’s go back climate change.

So, yes.

So may things are closed cycle.

There’s more as the same number of room that’s on the planet.

53:53

Now, as there were 150 years ago, difference is now more, domesticated less wild but in terms of actual tone, so there’s more or less the same that methane being belched out with me from one animals or farm animals want to say well I don’t know that.

Yes this is it’s a fact which is overlooked all the time and it’s very frustrating for someone myself gets here.

54:11

This method are being put out and and and the reason is put out there is yes.

Where would we be able to find?

This fact, there will be people screaming.

This is not that it’s all factory.

Farming animals everywhere, belching and farting away, I’m quoting from thoughts, I’ve been to buy, five people far, more knowledge of me again, obviously, that those figures are out there somewhere.

54:33

But the fact is, if you look at the the loss of the Bison, a lot of the wildebeest, the loss of wild animals everywhere deer.

And this perfect.

Yeah, then then it kind of makes sense and You almost hit relevantly or irrelevant to it?

54:51

Is the fact is that?

Yes, they both shot me think.

Let me think this is that a fear Ten Years Later turns.

Into carbon dioxide is reabsorbed by the plant.

In photosynthesis pumps, not pumps nutrients back and saw it again carbon back into the soil.

Again, the grass is eaten by the cattle and the whole cycle goes round and round.

55:12

So it’s not adding it’s not adding to the carbon pool but isn’t carbonate Friend as well to plants.

Doesn’t it closely the strategies to get where made the comment?

We, I mean without it, but isn’t the planet Greener because we’ve got more carbon isn’t?

I’ve heard that as well.

Actually, we need carpet, mats.

55:28

Yeah, we need everything in Balance, that’s the key word in Balance the whole time.

And what’s caused the imbalance is the burning of fossil fuels.

We all know that it’s a true that no one’s to face.

Nobody wants to give up their cars.

Nobody wants to muscle it should.

But there’s so much So, the internet car again.

55:47

Sorry, bad timing.

I need to sort this out.

That’s can’t keep doing all my podcast like this.

So you’re not here.

You’re going to talk about and they’re an American point, you said yeah.

There’s a and I thought we should remember the chaps name now but he coined the phrase farming in Nature’s Farm in Nature’s Image watch what nature does and copy it because Nature has been doing it for centuries and it works and that’s everything.

56:13

Thing I do now is just that basically it’s not rocket.

Science is actually really quite simple because nature is all around us the whole time.

And what I love is you’ve got a real passion for what you do and I’m a believer that if you don’t love what you do and you’re not passionate about it because you’d rather not very good at it now or yeah.

56:31

And it’s just not good.

In the long jump should be doing it, you should be doing it.

No change.

You know, I worked in construction for over a decade infrastructure management.

I would like to think I was quite good at it but I hated it.

Where’s your dad?

Disappointed, when you didn’t become a farmer, he was disappointed when I became a riding instructor.

56:51

Because I was gay.

I had this very well-paid job.

It had a company flattened whopping company car.

I mean, incredibly well paid.

I look back now and some of job for life it is company and I gave it all up to going my horses and he was like you lost the plot the matter with you but I was passionate about, that’s my other passion.

57:13

I horses riding so I rode professionally for 25 years Rhoda British Eventing.

Team twice in the European championships and I’m one of those instructor probably 20 years ago and I’ve been coaching and teaching ever since and it gives me a lot of pleasure.

57:30

That’s why I still do.

I sort of don’t half a week of it.

I can tell you’re really happy whenever I see you on the farm, you’ve got a big smile on your face.

I mean you’re in your element so it’s great.

I have to have to confess.

I was secretly.

Hoping you’re going to pitch up today with a big box of beef say here, Ahmad, advertise you, but I mean, maybe next time and And so have you heard about Bill Gates, buying up all this land and America?

57:54

What have you heard about him?

What do you think of that?

I-i’ve heard of it.

I don’t know.

The detail.

I read his book.

What was that called now?

About the answer climate change.

And it was basically all Technology based technology at the answer.

Everything and I went to this roller coaster Society conference a couple weeks ago, Harper, Adams.

58:14

And there was a debate there and I said, Just be careful.

Technology has got us where we are now in farming.

Now, you’re blindly go down another road.

Following this technology, think it’s gone.

The answers nature provides, all the answers just look around you at the natural world and you’ll find all the answers, you need you don’t you know and it because the top of Technology they’re talking about is oh goodness me refining animal performance.

58:45

So The genetical modification so that animals are more food.

Efficient I’ve got yes.

So basically.

All right, so they basically digest they get more live weight gain out of the same calories.

59:04

Oh God.

So this is this is very similar parallels that we have, for example, in the world of medicine.

Yeah, you know we’re in the 2023, we’ve made so many advances, we’ve got this fancy technology all over all around us, you do?

Keep that we’ve never been so rich as a society we’ve never been so sick.

59:22

Clear so Beast.

Yes, they’re fat.

This idea that a dad bod is one where you’re carrying a beach ball in your tummy.

It’s just socially acceptable.

You know, we’re sick.

We’re sick Society.

This isn’t progress.

We’ve gone backwards.

If you look at pictures from the 1930s and 1920s, everybody was Slim, Trim and strong, and yeah, and we are a sick unhealthy society.

59:46

And the answer is, Only we need to get to less.

We I do.

That is always into.

Let’s do you know vaccinations?

Yeah, you know, increase the vaccinations increase medications increased drugs.

And I think as a doctor, no, no, we’d roll back.

This is what’s led us to the situation?

1:00:04

We need to go back to basics.

Yes, it properly, I’ve less stress.

Get rid of the technology.

That’s messing up her circadian rhythm and our dopamine heads, get back to that family unit, connect with nature.

And that’s your solution, not the tablet, or the vial.

1:00:20

And there’s syringe, you know, mental health isn’t on the radio every single day.

I’m here said so many times.

It drives me saying that, I’m, it’s not that.

I’m not sympathetic because there are generally people with mental health issues, but it seems to me that everyone’s got a mental health issue.

1:00:37

You know anything?

Well, is that right?

Or is it just a dissatisfaction with the life they’re living?

And they Clean.

It is being mental health issues because they’re not very happy.

Mmm and you just hit the dopamine hit so you know I do a lot of the farmer.

Do you still do quite a lot of physical work.

1:00:54

I don’t want to wear a pedometer but I did I walked a long way every day and exercise makes you feel good.

It’s a well-known fact.

It does you know and we are the more technology, the more robots.

We employ the more the less we do.

We just sit there with behind screens monitoring stuff whole time.

1:01:11

How is that ever going to make you our bodies of didn’t evolve to do that?

Job, you know?

So we need to actually go back to doing more practical work.

I think some people just aren’t just think they’re too clever.

You think they’re too clever?

And they got, they’ve got all the answers.

Yeah.

And it’s more technology and it’s and I think if they keep having it their way, there’s going to be a gravestone on planet Earth, and it’s going to say human beings thought, they were thought they were so smart, but they’re dumb as shit.

1:01:38

Yeah, I wouldn’t learn.

That’s the definition stupid.

Everyone does things wrong but we did wrong again.

And again, again, and I have let that is stupid.

So what about?

We need to wrap up now.

We’ve been chatting for quite a while.

I’m and definitely want you back because it’s been really amazing listening to.

1:01:56

I’m sure you’ve got a lot more to get off your chest, but in summary, Eating beef isn’t killing the planet.

It doesn’t make you a bad person and it’s actually great for the soil.

1:02:12

Great for the environment.

Did I miss anything know if we didn’t eat the pieces that make you racist?

If you eat beef?

If we didn’t, if we didn’t eat meat, we wouldn’t have animals.

It’s been zoos Think about it on that.

1:02:27

Do you want to come beside this?

Bereft of animals just rape seed, crop.

I’ll give an example dung beetles rely on.

Dung from cattle.

We have no cattle to come to side.

We have no dung beetles, we have dung beetles in this country.

1:02:43

Oh good.

Yeah, it’s just, um, session.

Yeah, I used to think it was just Africa, you can make sure that he’s done on the great unheralded, insects of the natural world.

They are what process?

Or start the perp the the process of turning cow feces, into all that Matt ordered organic matter in the soil.

1:03:03

Wow, I didn’t know that I learn something new.

Well, what feasel dung beetles, most of our bird life so it’s always unintended consequences.

If you just, you take away all the animal.

If you stop eating me, take a wild animals from biodiversity point of view, it crashes.

1:03:19

Our health, our that’s my part.

I’m not you should nutritionist but I personally believe that we evolved as omnivores.

We should eat an omnivore diet.

Now, we do sell to carnivore any diet people as well.

And I have to say they’re incredibly healthy.

People seem to be so I’m actually an omnivore.

1:03:37

I agree with you.

I think we’re I’m an opportunity to stick more.

Yes.

You know.

Whatever is available.

That’s good.

That’s why human beings became the dominant.

Yeah, on this Earth because we are we Kind of we can it may see what we can also eat me.

1:03:57

And we can eat fish and we can do this and we do that.

We can so whatever’s available.

So I’m very heavy carnal Quito.

I have, you know, meat, I should know.

I come running quite a lot and burger steak sausage.

He’s most of it.

Lambie for venison.

1:04:12

Yep, I have chicken probably once a week and I have the vegetables on the side and potatoes.

You can see we’ve got the raised beds and we’re going potatoes here and beat Drew onions.

Yep, garlic savoy cabbage.

Don’t go crazy on the fruit apart from Barry’s blackberries raspberries strawberries.

1:04:29

And yeah, I’m not 100% carnivore if not for sure.

I think I said bet that balance and I also try and add in extra stuff that I wouldn’t normally have because that’s also very important member do more varied, the dive, the better.

I’d furthest in there as well.

If we, at seasonally, if we didn’t eat apples, other than in the Autumn when we Harvest them.

1:04:50

And then perhaps with the winter, if they’re stored, when you eat an apple, you would love it.

Yeah because they’re available whole year round and I’m gonna go off track you know, I guess this is perfect.

Fast food, as in fast, grown food, anything that’s forced is never ever good.

1:05:09

So most of our fruit and vegetable is irrigated irrigated fruit and vegetables, doesn’t taste everything, because it’s full of water.

The tomatoes don’t taste of tomatoes.

So it’s that look, nice, their glossy and red and all the rest of it.

They fulfill the aesthetic point of view, in terms of their dietary benefits 0-62 has behind.

1:05:30

You is Phil of tomatoes and the summer.

And the tomatoes.

Oh, when they do you mind, if they blow your mind with a pop inside your mouth shut and the same with the potatoes, we take them at the raised beds.

We wash them scrub them, boil them or and they are just incredible.

Yep.

1:05:45

And I think also, the seasonal thing is actually very important.

I think it’s about being in tune with nature.

I think we are.

We are natural beings.

Yes.

The Circadian rhythm you need to be grounded.

We need to be connecting to the air from the soil.

We need our hands have always been in the soil digging and Rummaging and we don’t do that anymore.

1:06:04

We’re to the biodiversity, the gut biome isn’t being exposed to the soil.

That’s why the kids were planting potatoes as well.

I mean systems aren’t as if that’s right.

Exactly.

And then the food we should be eating seasonal food.

What Mother?

Earth gives us know what we chose gives us all year round.

1:06:21

Yeah, I’m a big believer in what?

My father had a lovely expression.

He said oh they need to get, we had puppies and things they need to get bugged up.

Basically, you know, everyone, you know, puppies.

Why a puppy?

So sick of puppies are sick that one because they’re bred in sterile conditions?

1:06:38

Yeah.

And that they’ve got disinfectant everywhere the whole time in their puppy training.

Rest of it.

You know our puppies were read out in a kettle on straw.

I wasn’t sure if you’re talking about my kids are my kids got bikers grew up on a farm and you imagine they got pretty dirty and they got bucked up and they’re the healthiest kids in their class.

1:06:57

Probably because I love that because I don’t know.

I’m old enough now to remember when I He’s a kid.

No one had any allergies.

No one had autism everyone.

Now, you have a birthday party.

You kids are the same age as my.

By the way, straight away is like any food allergies and there’s also a bloody nightmare.

1:07:15

Oh, good, it can’t have this can’t have that.

Yep, can’t have that.

You know, and it’s this serious allergies, this is not normal.

And one of the things I find incredulous is ice, no one asking any questions.

Why is no one saying?

Well, as well as come from, where does all this come from?

I don’t have the answers but I have the Shins.

1:07:33

Yeah, the allergy say, ADHD the autism, this isn’t normal.

It’s an explosion and along with the mental health and I think a lot of it has got to do exposure to the biome, the soil, the food and nutrition.

1:07:49

The the stress, the vaccinations you name it.

There’s a whole host of things that we need to look into but no one’s that no one’s even in EM, no one’s investigating but no one’s even asking the question.

Which I find incredible.

Well yeah, we’ve gone off topic a little bit but listen, thank you for coming pleasure.

1:08:09

It’s been a pleasure talking to its it was, this was unscripted, we’ve had some technical issues.

The kids have come in and try to distract us.

You’re a very good by the way, my focus, you didn’t keep your focus.

So thank you so much for coming and I’d love you to come back.

1:08:26

Are you pleasure?

You don’t need to bring the beef box, but anyway, is it anywhere?

Where the listeners can find you are you on social media, do tweet, the internet website, great social media people.

We are on Facebook, native beef.

1:08:43

If you Google native beef, it will come up top of the list pretty much and we’re based at shelves and tiles a little farm just on the favor 13, we say run the butcher shop on the farm.

We are open as you know this Wednesday.

1:08:59

Thursday and Friday between three and seven Saturday between 10 and 12.

You can pre-order or we can just drop in and see what we’ve got.

You know, we have a bit of everything and we’d love to show you around the farm.

We’ve nothing to hide.

We’re very open with everything we do.

And in terms of that when we really animals, The Butchery dry aging the beef and all that kind of thing, so yeah, anyways, welcome dropping.

1:09:22

Thank you and can I just ask something?

There’s a lot of people who do do postal orders and deliveries, have you ever thought about that?

So people who do and we do We do career deliveries, okay?

It kind of goes against the grain a little bit.

1:09:37

If I’m honest, you know, we have supplied restaurants in London, on your nose, fairly small scale.

We spider clingy for one of their restaurants for five or six years, but it was, I don’t want you to get too successful.

That’s the, that’s the problem.

1:09:54

This is exactly.

I became a butcher so that I could make money as a farmer Right?

I had no ambition, to become a butcher, but I realized just selling meat into the hole into the hole.

So, Market was fruitless task.

You weren’t, you can make a living at doing that.

1:10:09

And so, I wanted to sell my beef locally.

I want to get feedback on it.

I wanted to, you know, tell the whole story of food.

So let me give you some feedback.

I don’t think I’ve given you this feedback.

So I’ve been, I’m a bit of a foodie.

So this kid that grew up in Glasgow and working-class rough area, far removed from lush green.

1:10:29

Fucking, I’m sure.

Yeah, trust me, you know, it’s kind of bizarre, taking my kids to the road down Museum, just down the road.

Yeah, and you know, when I would read Danny the champion of the world and read about pheasants, everything was written around this area, a little book, brilliant picture and you know, I was living in a concrete, jungle surrounded by heroin addicts and alcoholics, we go average life expectancy is like 42 and and I couldn’t imagine it was just it was a magical world that scene and now my children grew up seeing deer Munch Jack and pheasants and it’s just common place and I just think of one generation.

1:11:04

What a difference?

Yeah it’s just kind of gives me goosebumps.

Yeah it’s magical where we’re living right now.

You have kind of lost my train of thought.

Anyway, I’ve become a foodie still from eating pretty rubbish food as a kid growing up.

My parents were susceptible to the ads and we had findus Krispies and cakes.

1:11:22

And and KFC buckets, and all that stuff.

Now, I love my food, it’s very important and I got a really nice restaurant.

It’s even Michelin three-star.

Restaurants, I can tell you.

I’ve never had steak as nice as a steak that I get from your farm and cook in my kitchen.

1:11:40

So, that’s the facts about Implement.

No greater compliment for me.

Quite frankly, it’s, we love getting the feedback and that again is why we don’t do, if they do sell on the internet and we don’t on purpose.

The reason we do something’s there is because you have to have a pack size and then the every have to be exactly the same.

1:11:59

And the internet is completely impersonal.

You never meet anyone, they send you an audio through your package.

You sent off.

No feedback.

Nothing we could, because our customers most of our customers come and pick up their food from us, we get, we know them all personally, that’s a quick last.

I’ve got just in my head if a listener can access you you’re not local enough.

1:12:18

Is there a network a website where they can find Farmers like you?

Yes, you, you know?

All right.

So yeah, tell me.

Where can they find the hot?

Pasture-fed?

Livestock Association.

You could Google pasture-fed, livestock Association, they have a website on that website is a list of Producers, pasture-fed, Livestock Association and that your what put in your postcode and they’ll tell you local farms with you’ve gone to their you.

1:12:42

So that they’ll have a list of suppliers and buckinghamshire don’t have me and probably a couple others after wherever and that.

Yeah you’ll find someone who will be reasonably local to you.

It will all farm.

Same standards that I do great and I think this is the way future I think For our own Freedom.

1:13:01

We need to go local.

We need to cut out the supermarket’s for our own health.

I keep saying to people the best expression of freedom is actually good health, and support your local communities, and support your local farmers.

But listen, thank you so much.

1:13:16

Jonathan Wilson, thank you very much, pleasure.

Thank you much.

And thanks everyone for listening.